I wanted to start by asking a little bit about your background, and how social class affected you growing up?
All of my family were working class. It didn't impact me in a huge way where it was detrimental to my childhood or anything. Perhaps it was the one or two social occasions where kids being kids would make fun of where you live or silly things like that. We didn't have an awful lot of money, but we just kind of plodded along and did what we did. My mum was a cleaner, my gran was a cleaner, my uncle worked for the council, my other uncle was a postman and still is to this day. So I grew up in that kind of atmosphere, and a lot of what we did wasn't necessarily very lavish. Everything was very family-centric, sometimes church on a Sunday. It was largely just very family-orientated.
A lot of people I've spoken to for this have said the same sort of thing, that they grew up in a working class background but it didn't really affect them, because everyone they knew was also working class. You almost don't notice.
You don't really think of it when you're a kid, either. You’re just immersed in whatever world is around you. I mean, maybe you might slightly compare your life to a friend’s, but not in a way where it's like: “Why don't I have what they have?” You’re around people who are effectively living the same life as you in many ways.
With that background, did you ever think that turning music into a full-time career was ever something you'd be able to do?
I don't think I ever saw it as a career. When I was younger, I definitely didn't see it as a career. And I think that's probably down to the fact that at school, it wasn't really highlighted as a viable career choice. Of course, you could take lessons and stuff, but you were pushed towards careers that were taken more seriously by people. Unfortunately, it's still the same today. Music and arts sectors are overlooked and not funded properly. I definitely didn't see it as a career because I went off to study graphic design before I did anything else. It was a happy, lucky stumble into a career, I think.
And were there any working class people already in the field of music who inspired you and helped you to find your way?
[With] the music that I listened to as a kid. I don't think I was necessarily thinking about the class of the people I was listening to. It's a very similar thing to the people who are around you, right? But I guess Dolly Parton is a really great example. She came from a family of 11 or 12 siblings, which I can't even fathom because I have no siblings. Avril Lavigne, as well, came from a working class background in Canada, I think. She has a song about being fired from a chicken shop she used to work in and things like that. But I can't say that I ever had an awareness of the [class of the] people that I was listening to back then.
How did you then get your first opportunity to enter the world of music?
My first opportunity would have been a student radio station. They did a call-out for songwriters to submit songs, and they had a foundation that they ran. The patron of that foundation was Kylie Minogue and she would pick one of her favourite songs and you'd win an award and other things. It was a free opportunity and it was one that came through word of mouth as well. So I think I got lucky for sure. But it was definitely the first significant kind of thing that happened. It definitely took me out of the world that I knew into something completely different and opened my eyes to the fact that it could be a worthwhile career path, even moreso than how I was treating it at the time.
Emma McGann has combined live-streaming with traditional performances
Absolutely, and what were the barriers you hit as you were trying to get from that point to the point where it was your full-time job?
I think it's the same for a lot of artists. There's always been a kind of knowledge gap, and I think it's kind of largely to do with what you're taught at an early age in school. There's not always that access, even to music lessons, dependent on if you have to pay for them, if they're extra-curricular, if they're accessible in the school at all. But that wasn't necessarily a barrier for me. My mum did actually encourage me to take up some kind of instrument. She wanted me to take up violin, but I wanted to be a bit noisier and play guitar.
I think your music would have been very different if you'd taken up the violin at that age.
Wildly different! So that wasn't necessarily a barrier for me, but I know it is for a lot of people. Education is the first step where there's a big knowledge gap for people. I mentor a lot of artists today that are at the university level. Some don't have knowledge of how they can monetise what they're doing or how they can sustain themselves financially, which is obviously a huge problem. If you're at university level and that knowledge isn't quite there yet, and it hasn't been instilled, there's questions there. Shouldn't this be brought in earlier?
I can see that being a big barrier. It was for me. Going back to that first opportunity I had, I was studying at the time and I didn't necessarily have all the knowledge that I would find a few years down the line after graduating. So there's definitely room for more education in that sense for upcoming artists. I think a lot of artists these days are a lot more savvy and a lot more willing to do the groundwork to learn how they can actually make it sustainable, which is really, really great. Artists should definitely keep doing that, especially because not everybody out there is gonna just sit there and tell you exactly how to do it.
This is actually a really good point to bring streaming into the conversation as well, because that was obviously huge for you. I think, for artists who are from a working class background, particularly those outside of London and the big cities, things like streaming and more unconventional monetisation routes are a great way for working class artists to break through and find a way to make this a full-time job like you did.
Absolutely. I think there's caveats to it where it does require a lot of work. I mean, I've been a streamer now for about 12 years, so it's been a long, long term thing for me. It’s the core way where I've actually been able to make what I do sustainable. It's a large portion of the pie that enables me to do what I do. I feel like it can definitely be a route. It's not a clear-cut one.
It's a very competitive space as well these days. I got started when there weren't very many musicians taking on that route. So because I was an early adopter, I think it worked out well for me, but it is definitely still an add-on that you can attach to what you're already doing if you're already touring, doing live shows, and selling albums. It's definitely a worthwhile avenue to explore. It's not for everybody because it can be quite isolating, being in front of the camera all the time, with no one in the room. But it's been significant in enabling me to continue doing music, for sure.
And in that time that you've been doing this, do you think there have been any changes either for better or for worse, in working class representation in music?
Yeah, I think so. When I was back at uni studying, I think if we take the charts, for example, they looked wildly different to how they do now. It's a really interesting moment to talk to you about this because of the news that Oasis are coming back next year. I kind of see that as a good thing for your average band who might be rehearsing in their garage right now because there is no representation for bands in the charts. It's mostly like individuals who are doing pop, who are doing grime, who are doing rap. We've kind of lost bands along the way somewhere. So I'm hoping secretly that Oasis being back in the spotlight might be a good influence for more bands to have a little peak again. That would be really nice to see. I can't remember the last time I found a really decent new, fresh band, whether they be indie or whatever, in the charts. So there's definitely been that change over the years, for sure.
What do you think needs to change to make more and better working class representation in music?
I think it starts with education. There needs to be more resources in place at an earlier stage, where aspiring musicians can become aware that it is a viable career path. I feel like, had I known when I was a kid that it could be, perhaps I would have even been in music a little while longer and that knowledge would’ve come to me a little sooner. I think it starts with education. I think it starts with resources, and those resources being free and accessible to kids as well. Bridging that knowledge gap is really, really important.
And on that note of education, what advice would you give to any working class people who want to break into music today?
Well, the first thing I'd say is never slip into the mindset that your class is going to define your success in chasing music, because anybody can do it. That's one of the beautiful things about music. It’s open to all, and nothing will hinder you in that instance. But I would also say there are opportunities and funding available to everyone throughout the UK, whatever stage you are at in your career, and no matter your background.
So I will point you in the direction of Help Musicians UK, who do some wonderful work. Actually, they have a mentorship program called Co-Pilot, which I’m a mentor for. They basically assign you a music industry mentor for up to six months, and it's free as well. So all you have to do is apply to that. That's worth checking out and then also check out UK Music, who do a lot of work and guiding policy. They're a voice for artists, especially in the realms of education, and they have some really great free resources on their website that come in the form of career information packs. If you thought that going down the music route is a very narrow, one-job thing, it's very much not. There's many, many, many different types of jobs. You could be an engineer, you could be a producer, you could be a manager. There's lots of different lines of work. UK music does a great job of outlining all of that, and they also host a lot of in-person events, panels, conferences throughout the year across the UK.
Emma McGann performs on her keyboard
It's true about there being lots of different elements to music if you wanted to get in. I was watching your video about your streaming career, and you were saying that you were really helped out in your early days because you worked at a radio station, and it meant you had access to equipment. A lot of it is just about getting your foot in the door of the industry, and then finding ways that once you're in there, you can get to the place you want to get.
Absolutely, yeah. And until you're exposed to something, you don't really know what it is that you want to do. It's completely fine, not knowing. I didn't know for a very long time. I was studying graphic design for the longest time before I realised “no, actually, I want to do music full-time”. So having a better idea of exactly how many different types of skill sets you might already have that can be applied to different roles in the industry you want to go down is great. It's really worthwhile.
So check out all the career information packs on UK Music. They're really well put together and I think it just really effectively highlights the fact that it's completely possible for you to go down that route if that's something that you want to do.
Before I let you go, is there anything you wanted to say in this interview that you haven’t already?
You definitely brought up some questions where I've been like: “Wow, I've never thought about that before.” Especially thinking about the music that I used to listen to and not really thinking from an awareness point of view of the class background of the person. So I'm actually really interested in checking out all the artists that I used to listen to back then and seeing where they kind of came from.
There's a lot of artists who are really talented, but are kind of born into it as well. There's that whole conversation around the “nepo baby” thing. It's a hard conversation to have with people because you can't help being born into something, right? It doesn't mean you can't be talented at the same time. I do feel for people and some friends of mine who have had that experience as well, because they're some of the most talented people I know. But there needs to be plenty of space for other people.
Find out more about Emma McGann's music by visiting her official website.
0 Comments